BERAL, INC.
Andrew Racz
Director of Research
300 East 54 Street, Suite 26C
New York, NY 10022
Phone: (212) 319-6949
Fax: (212) 753-1944
E-mail: mlikar@aol.com

Interview With Houston Hunt

February 23, 2011

In 1980, I recommended Bunker Hunt for the Nobel Prize in Economics.

He was the first person who invested in Hard Assets, including gold, silver and sugar.

Andrew Racz is
Financial Advisor
to
Silver Dragon, Inc.,
a Toronoto and Beijng-based"
Silver Company

ANDREW RACZ: How are you?

HOUSTON HUNT: Just fine, Andrew.

AR: I've got very bad news for you.

HOUSTON HUNT: What's that?

AR: Some analysts think that silver at $30 is overpriced.

HOUSTON HUNT: That happens, I'm sure. It may be. Who knows?

AR: I have just a few questions. Everybody is competing for writing up the "story of Bunker Hunt". It's interesting. Let me start with this. I read a book a few years ago written by the youngest daughter of Winston Churchill. In that book, she said, "I was around sixteen or seventeen when I realized that my main role in life was that I was Winston Churchill's daughter." Now, I want to ask you, when did you realized that you were Bunker Hunt's son?

HOUSTON HUNT: I never thought about it that way. I suppose I was maybe fourteen or fifteen years old, something like that.

AR: You realized that your father was an unusual person?

HOUSTON HUNT: Yes.

AR: May I ask what were the symptoms?

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't know about symptoms, but he was clearly someone who had inclinations to handle large amounts of wealth, or evidence of large amounts of wealth. So that made it unusual. AR: He was a wise man. He also had a unique physical appearance. He was also very charming.

HOUSTON HUNT: I guess primarily at that time he was an oil man.

AR: Recently Warren Buffett said when he was before a Congressional committee, which he dislikes, he said "I don't blame Goldman Sachs if I lose money. I make my own calculations." An oil man like Bunker Hunt, did he make his own calculations? What did he do in the morning?

HOUSTON HUNT: He was in the oil business, so most of the time you deal with people and personnel, and you deal with decisions that have to be made regarding leasing or not leasing, and the decisions that you make regarding wells, to drill wells or not to drill wells.

AR: Do you recall when he decided to go to Libya?

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't. I was two years old or so when that happened (1970).

AR: And the North Sea?

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't remember it specifically. I would have been about ten.

AR: And the sugar business?

HOUSTON HUNT: I vaguely remember that. I was probably thirteen or fourteen at that time.

AR: Great Western United, correct?

HOUSTON HUNT: Great Western United was the name of the holding.

AR: In the Philippines. HOUSTON HUNT: No, actually it was mostly in the U.S. sugar beets.

AR: A knew a company called R.W. Beresford. It was one of the biggest sugar, cocoa, and coffee traders in London. They traded certain other things and I was introduced to the chairman, and he said, "Tell me, do you know Bunker Hunt?" I said yes. He said, "Will you introduce me? I would like to get his sugar business." Beresford was a famous company, but he went to Dallas, met your father in the late Seventies, and I think he did some sugar business with him and he visited him a few times in London, and apparently got on very well. The Beresford people said, you know, he made more money in the sugar business than my whole American clientele altogether. But he was one of the favorite figures in the City of London. He was basically a very popular person, a people person. Correct?

HOUSTON HUNT: I spent so little time in London and talked to so few people over there, I couldn't tell you.

AR: No, but as an individual he was a people person.

HOUSTON HUNT: He was a very personable person. Unfortunately, now with Alzheimer's he's lost some of that.

AR: It's terrible but people live longer.

HOUSTON HUNT: They do, they do indeed.

AR: You have a large family.

HOUSTON HUNT: I do, yes.

AR: Was the family working jointly on oil exploration? HOUSTON HUNT: No, not really. Everybody sort of does their own thing.

AR: How did a person like you and others, how did they learn the oil business so that they could make decisions like a trader?

HOUSTON HUNT: I couldn't tell you. I really don't know.

AR: It must be more complicated, because if I decide to buy Hecla Mining, ten minutes later I can sell it. But if you are in the oil exploration business and you said, okay, we'll put so much money here, you can't pull it back the following minute.

HOUSTON HUNT: That is true.

AR: So where do you learn this expertise? If you asked me to make these decisions, I would say I'd rather give up the money before I start.

HOUSTON HUNT: I guess you're in the business and you just pick it up as you go along. You read and you talk to people, and there's no definite process.

AR: This is what I would like to know. Everybody remembers the events of 1979-1980, Bunker Hunt and his family. David Hunt and his father were in oil, you are in oil. Where do you learn that expertise? Family money was basically made in oil.

HOUSTON HUNT: That's correct. I don't know. You learn by doing. How do you learn to be a writer? You write. How do you learn to be a singer? You sing. How do you learn to be in the oil business? You're in the oil business, and you just do the best you can. AR: Let me tell you something. I worked for eight years with Governor John B. Connolly of Texas. He told me, and I'm very proud of it, he said, "Andrew, if you had been born here in Texas and started early, you would have become America's best political speech writer." That's one of the few things in life I'm really proud of. But in your family, there are many oil people, and it's important to reflect that what made the Hunt family great is oil. Oil and gas is an expertise, and members of several generations had this expertise. How do you acquire this expertise?

HOUSTON HUNT: By being alert and paying attention, I suppose. There are many very bright people out there, and you just try and listen to them and learn what you can.

AR: To go back to the mid-Seventies, if you recall when did your father decide that something may be very very bad in the U.S.A.? Trouble with money, monetary values and Jimmy Carter.

HOUSTON HUNT: I really don't know. Inflation was already starting in the United States at that time. If you recall, Gerald Ford was president and he had a slogan called "Whip inflation now", the WIN program. That's when my father became concerned that maybe currency really wasn't as important as perhaps owning the physical assets.

AR: Then what did he do?

HOUSTON HUNT: He began to acquire hard assets. He diversified out of oil and gas into real estate. He diversified into precious metals. He diversified into the sugar beet refining business.

AR: This was a very well conceived act. HOUSTON HUNT: Who knows if it was that well conceived, but it was a concern that he had that currency, not just U.S. currency but all currencies, would be of less value than owning the hard assets.

AR: It's interesting, I remember those days very vividly, that the media ostracized Bunker Hunt for these thoughts. And you mentioned the word "hard assets". On my desk there is an invitation to a conference, which is now given three times a year, a hard asset conference. In other words, thirty years later supposedly the best financial brains get together on hard assets, whereas thirty years ago you had a single man saying, listen, maybe trading is getting out of hand and I believe in Hard Assets. For no reason he was ostracized for it.

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't know if he was ostracized or not. It was a time of high inflation. It was clearly that. I wouldn't say he was ostracized. I think of a lot of poor people that have been shunned by other people, and Dad was never that. AR: Well, let me tell you something that I personally remember. In March or April, 1980, on a Friday afternoon I was coming out of the Carlyle Hotel and in comes in a taxi your father and your mother. I said, Mr. Hunt, I just wrote an article called "Gold and the Polish Debt". As I mentioned, currencies go down and I said maybe the Hunt brothers' dream will come true. Your father looked at a few pages and he said, "Caroline, come here, Andrew wrote a good article about us. There aren't many people who write nicely about us." That was true. Today you could say that maybe what I wrote that maybe the Hunts will have a dream come true, and it did come true. Poland wants to borrow, and they're sort of lending money. They need gold coverage, or whatever it is, and we are in a different world. And this different world is actually almost inevitable as it goes along, whereas thirty years ago your father and his brother Herbert were ahead of their time. I wrote that maybe the Hunt brothers' dream will come true. And in that article, I did say that if it does, I will recommend Bunker Hunt for the Nobel Prize for Economics. It was a personal event that if you look back to what we discussed, it was really a transformation of the monetary system which took thirty years to come and be a reality. This is what Bunker Hunt had foreseen in advance.

Now, my question is you have an oil family. Everybody is in oil, working hard apparently. How did the same people develop the new monetary system? The inevitability of the new monetary system.

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't know if it's an inevitability. I don't really know if they were trying a new monetary system.

AR: It was the commodity system.

HOUSTON HUNT: Yes, it was the commodity system. Things at that time, by the Seventies, you'd seen what had happened in many Latin American countries. They had gone into this hyper inflation type thing, and obviously you'd seen what had happened in Europe in the post-World War I time frame. So there had been currencies that have fallen and collapsed, and there was just a concern that that same thing might happen with the U.S. dollar.

AR: Who are what you call your family? HOUSTON HUNT: Oh, gosh. Literally I have first cousins and second cousins and everything else, but Herbert is my uncle. Maybe that would be a simpler way to say it. My dad is Bunker Hunt. Then my dad has brothers and sisters in addition to that. But the ones that are really involved in the times past in investing were really his brothers Herbert and Lamar. Lamar has passed on, Herbert is still very healthy at the age of 80, 81 maybe. He's in good health. But many of the siblings have passed on.

AR: David is his son?

HOUSTON HUNT: David Hunt is Herbert's son, yes.

AR: He's in business.

HOUSTON HUNT: Yes, he is.

AR: He's also in oil?

HOUSTON HUNT: He does oil and some other things, yes.

AR: If your father were 40 years old today, what would he do?

HOUSTON HUNT: I'm not sure. That's a very good question. I suppose he'd still be in the oil business. I don't know what he would do with hard assets, but unfortunately he's not 40 today, he's 84 and he'll turn 85 next month. And he's not as healthy as he used to be.

AR: But if he were 40 today, how would he spend his days?

HOUSTON HUNT: I suppose like he did when he was 40 the other time, which is worrying about the oil business and other general things.

AR: But he had the stock market, no? HOUSTON HUNT: Not really. He did very little in the stock markets. He was primarily a guy that was involved in hard assets and real estate, and the oil business. Those are the three things.

AR: Oil is at $100. When I left Hungary in 1956, one and a half billion people worked. Today five billion people work. The consumption, compared to the one and a half billion, is probably ten times larger. When you have consumption, you need oil. Oil and sugar. These are two things you need. If you take a ten-year viewpoint ahead, and your father had the ability to have this foresight, ten years of only 105% growth in oil consumption, it completely changed the monetary system and that would give very great income-producing capability for experienced oil men. The world has never seen $100 oil for a long time, and I presume it is very helpful for oil production.

HOUSTON HUNT: I'm sure it is. I'm sure it's a better time with oil at $100 for someone who's producing oil.

AR: He was the Donald Trump of the international oil business.

HOUSTON HUNT: I don't know about that. There are many substantial people in the oil business, and you would just be somebody trying to do the best you can.

AR: He must have been a very good oil man.

HOUSTON HUNT: He was good, but Mr. Trump's very good at real estate and other things, and I don't know if my dad would ever be quite of his stature in America, or the world for that matter. AR: But he could see something coming, that for ten years to come oil would be at least $100 a barrel. He would see some very big money-making opportunities.

HOUSTON HUNT: Very possible.

AR: We're going back to 40.

HOUSTON HUNT:  Clearly there are a lot of opportunities in all businesses right now because there's such a steady flux.

AR: If you have consistently every day, every year, at least $100 oil, that's an extraordinary state of affairs, and an extraordinary family with knowledge of the oil business could do miracles.

HOUSTON HUNT: It would help. There's no question it would help.

AR: I always thought that your father was an exceptional person, an exceptionally intelligent person. He also had an ability to attract publicity and attention, and the attention was probably because he was brilliant. I know the North Sea advantage was brilliant and so was Libya. But when we go now to the next 30 or 40 years, the people with Bunker Hunt's brain, if they were 40 again, could probably create very constructive things. And at the same time, because of the last 30 or 40 years, the United States is not in such great shape as the Hunt family would be at an earlier age in 2011. In other words, people have gone up and their memory will survive, but the country has gone down. So in that regard, in the 1970's when Bunker Hunt broke onto the world's attention he was right. Unfortunately, he was right because of the commodity theories and he was also right, which we all regret, about the decline of the United States. HOUSTON HUNT: I don't know if he thought that the country was going to decline. It was simply a matter of the monetary system, and he was very strong on Hard Assets. Let's just leave it at that.

AR: But he foresaw later things, and that is what a great man is supposed to do. That was Albert Einstein, that was Churchill, and...who was the famous oil man in Texas?

HOUSTON HUNT: Howard Hughes.

AR: Yes, Howard Hughes. They foresaw something like this fellow Steve Jobs foresaw something. And in a way when they foresaw the future, they unfortunately took into consideration that our country in 2011 will not be the same as 1975.

HOUSTON HUNT: Obviously, the country is a different place. I don't know, we'll see. However, I and my brothers and family are glad we were all related to Bunker Hunt who, in February, 2011, is still alive.

Disclaimer

Information contained herein is based on data obtained from recognized statistical services, issuers reports or communications or other sources believed to be reliable. However, such information has not been verified by us and we do not make any representation to its accuracy or completeness. Any statement non-factual in nature constitutes only current opinions which are subject to change. BERAL INC. or their officers, directors, analysts or employees may have positions in the securities or commodities referred to herein, and may as principal or agent buy and sell such securities or commodities. An employee, analyst, officer or a director of BERAL INC. may serve as a director for companies mentioned in this report. Neither the information nor any comment expressed shall constitute an offer to sell or a solicitation of an offer to buy any securities or commodities mentioned herein. There may be instances when fundamental, technical and competitive opinions may not be in concert. This firm may from time to time perform investment banking or other services for or which investment banking or other businesses from any company mentioned in this report.

 

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Andrew Racz. 300 East 54 Street, Suite 26C, New York, NY 10022
Phone: (212) 319-6949 Fax: (212) 753-1944. E-mail: mlikar@aol.com

Copyright © 2011 Andrew Racz. All Rights Reserved.

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